I would like to personally welcome Battery Mooch to TasteYourJuice.com.
“Mooch” is well known in the industry as the “battery guy” and is quite popular on the ECF. I’ve worked with Mooch several times in the background and he’s always been quite helpful and knowledgeable in answering my questions.
Although I have some experience with battery testing, Mooch has all the experience I lack so I though it a good fit to offer him his own page here on TasteYourJuice.com.
If you look to the left, you’ll see the new Battery Mooch page under Information/Resources. His first article can be found there as well.
WELCOME MY FRIEND!
Who is Battery Mooch?
My name is John Muchow, some of you may know me as Mooch on ECF and FB and Mooch315
on ECR. I have been vaping since April, 2015 and haven’t smoked once since I
started!I was born and raised in New York City and still live there now. Since 1992 I have
been designing and building electronic devices for a large number of clients. My
first products were camera remote-control systems for sports photographers. As these
systems, and other devices, transitioned from wired to wireless the performance of
the batteries they used was very important as there was no way to replace them
during use. This led to me doing more and more battery testing and developing the
electronics to charge, test, and protect them.As battery technology advanced, from NiCd to NiMH to Li-Ion and now
ultracapacitor/Li-Ion hybrids, the devices I built and the battery testing I did
advanced along with them. I started specializing in power management electronics;
battery chargers, energy harvesters (for charging from heat, light, or
vibration/movement), power supplies, battery analyzers, electronic loads for battery
discharging, and battery management/protection systems. This is the work I still do
today.My clients have included the US Army, National Geographic, Sports Illustrated,
Eastman Kodak Company, and hundreds of other companies from large to small. Part of
the work I’ve done for a lot of my clients has been battery testing. Sometimes they
want to recommend a good battery to their customers. Other times they’re batteries I
have chosen to combine with my electronics to form a complete, protected power
source for them to incorporate into their products.Depending on my client’s requirements this testing can take up to several weeks to
complete. I use a subset of these tests when evaluating the batteries we use when
vaping. This includes continuous-current tests to establish the battery’s true (and
safe) ratings. They also help to determine if there’s any risk of venting if one of
our mods autofires or a mechanical mod’s button is accidentally pressed. The
pulse-current tests measure the degree of voltage sag we would see when vaping at
different current levels. Both types of tests are done the same way for every set of
batteries I test.This consistency in the testing allows for direct comparison of the performance of
different batteries even if the pulse discharging I do doesn’t match the way you
vape.Safety is my number one priority. While I often test at discharge current levels
that can result in unsafe battery temperatures, this is the only way to figure out
what a battery’s true and safe ratings are. No battery is totally safe but we can
certainly avoid taking unnecessary risks.My blog at ECF has the results of all my testing and a few articles on batteries,
battery safety, etc.:https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/mooch.256958/
I have also listed the equipment I use and the steps I follow when testing. This
allows anyone to replicate my tests if they want to:https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/my-cell-testing-equipment-and-setup.7431/
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/whats-done-for-each-cell-test.7433/
My battery test results offer you a resource you can use when choosing a battery
that will not only be safer for the way you vape but will also give you great
performance.I’m looking forward to contributing to TasteYourJuice.com and I want to thank
PBusardo for the opportunity to help spread the word on exaggerated battery ratings
and battery safety!Mooch
Latest Battery Updates
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Batteries are married to each other, not to the mod
Ignoring whether marrying your batteries is really necessary or not, ANY set of married batteries can be used in ANY mod as long as you’re not exceeding the limits of the batteries.
It doesn’t matter if you’re moving them from a series mod to a parallel mod, or vice-versa, the batteries won’t care. They don’t know what type of mod they’re in or how that mod is wired up.
You can remove any number of batteries from a married set and still use that set. For example, you can take one battery out of a married set from a 3-battery mod like the Reuleaux RX200 and use the remaining two married batteries in a 2-battery mod like the H-Priv.
Just don’t try to add batteries to a married set. They all need to be married from the start.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Can I use battery X in mod Y?
I’m often asked this question, or a variation of it. Can a certain battery can be used in a particular mod or type of mod? Especially for mods like the Noisy Cricket and other mechanical mods.
The answer is easy…you can use ANY battery in ANY mod as long as it fits and your power setting (for a regulated mod) or coil resistance (for an unregulated/mechanical mod) doesn’t exceed the capability of the battery.
You don’t need a Sony VTC5A or LG HB6 if you’re using 0.2 ohms coils, or higher, in a single battery mechanical mod. Or if you’re using 0.4 ohm coils, or higher, in a Noisy Cricket. You’ll be drawing less than 20A and can easily use 3000mAh HG2’s, 30Q’s, or VTC6’s instead and enjoy the extra vaping time before needing to recharge.
It’s the same for regulated mods. There’s no need to use high amp-rated batteries like the VTC4, VTC5A, or HB6 in mods like the RX200 because you can’t draw more than 23A from the batteries. Any good 20A battery can handle that since it’s pulsed.
This holds true for any mod, power setting, or coil resistance. What matters is matching your battery’s true capabilities to the way you vape. But be aware of exaggerated battery ratings!
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Hohm Tech HohmGrown 32.3A 4307mAh 26650 Bench Test Results…a 23A battery, identical to Basen/Brillipower 4500mAh
Bottom Line: This is only a 23A cell that I am rating at 4300mAh. It is identical in appearance and performance to the Basen and Brillipower 4500mAh cells. It is damaged after just a single discharge at its 32.3A rating and the voltage at that discharge current level is very low. The Grown cell only delivers 181mAh down to 3.2V at its rated 32.3A.
Having said this, it is still one of the better performing 26650’s as it seems to use the same cell as the Basen and Brillipower 4500mAh cells. The 26650 ratings/performance table has been updated to include the Grown cell.
This testing has been part of a weeks-long series of events that have also involved Hohm Tech. I want to say that Hohm Tech strongly believes that their testing methods and ratings are valid and accurate and they stand firmly by them. They insist that the HohmGrown cell is an improvement over the cell that is used by Basen and Brillipower. I am unable to explain why I do not see that difference in my testing.
Test results, discharge graph, photos: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/threads/hohm-tech-hohmgrown-32-3a-4307mah-26650-bench-test-results-only-23a-same-as-basen-brillipower.755049/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: G-King 18650 graphene battery specs
There’s been some talk regarding the newly announced G-King graphene 18650 battery and I’ve been getting some questions about its capabilities. Here’s a video for it…
http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/dongxu-graphene-battery-pack-15-minutes-recharge-news/
The most important thing to be aware of when watching this video and/or reading the press releases is that the 4800mAh battery they refer to and demonstrate is a battery pack, not an individual cell. The individual 18650’s used in the pack are rated at 1100mAh and 5.5A. You can see this in the video when they show several of the blue cells.
You can also see that these cells have a nominal voltage of 3.2V versus the 3.6V/3.7V nominal voltage of the cells we normally use when vaping. This means that they can’t be used in a regulated mod because it would very quickly signal weak battery due to the low voltage.
So while graphene batteries hold great promise for high-capacity, low to medium-amp batteries in the future the 18650 G-King 1100mAh, 5.5A battery isn’t a great choice for vaping with right now.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: The Sony VTC6 is not rated at 30A!
I’m still testing this 3000mAh battery but wanted to address some misinformation going around. Just like the other Sony VTC batteries, the max continuous current ratings are being read incorrectly.
As you can see in the attached datasheet image the Continuous Maximum Discharge Current rating is 30A, but only if the battery temperature does not exceed 80°C! It is a temperature-limited rating and this is critical. This means that the 30A rating is only a maximum current level for short-term discharges and is not a true continuous rating.
Below the 30A Continuous Maximum Discharge Current rating in the datasheet you can see the true continuous rating, 15A.
I should have my tests done in a few days as I am also directly comparing the VTC6 against HG2’s and 30Q’s.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Beware of high-amp, high-capacity battery ratings!
If you’re thinking of trying any of the high amp-rated, high capacity 18650 batteries just remember…
There are no 3000mAh batteries rated above 20A (continuous).
There are no over-3000mAh batteries rated above 10A (continuous) and some are a lot lower.
If the wrap says otherwise, it’s a false rating and that company is not being honest with you.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Shockli Blue 30A 2400mAh 18650 Bench Test Results…a poor performing 17A battery
Bottom Line: This is a poor performing cell that I am rating at 17A/2400mAh. While the wrap does list both the continuous and pulse ratings, normally a very good thing, its claimed 30A continuous rating is wildly exaggerated. Its high internal resistance, nearly double that of most good 20A cells, means that it suffers from considerable voltage sag. At 25A continuous it got hot enough to boil water and at its claimed 30A continuous rating its voltage quickly collapsed. Its pulse performance was significantly below that of most 15A-20A cells. Its appearance doesn’t match any battery I’ve tested so far.
Test results, discharge graph, photos: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/threads/shockli-blue-30a-2400mah-18650-bench-test-results-a-poor-performing-17a-battery.752567/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Efest Metallic Purple 7A 700mAh 18350 Bench Test Results.. a poor performing 4A battery
Bottom Line: This metallic wrap Efest cell is a poor performer and I rate it at 4A. It is much worse than its predecessor, the 7A 700mAh V2 purple cell and performs very much like the V1 version. Its capacity is good for its rating though and I rate it at 800mAh. It lists both the continuous and pulse ratings on the wrap, which could be a good thing, but the continuous rating is exaggerated and the pulse rating is meaningless without knowing the pulse width, duty cycle, and the criteria for setting the rating (temperature? run time? voltage sag?).
Test results, discharge graph, photos: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/threads/efest-metallic-purple-7a-700mah-18350-bench-test-results-a-poor-performing-4a-battery.751677/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Busbars 25A 1750mAh 18650 Bench Test Results…accurately rated 25A, fantastic battery!
Bottom Line: This Busbar cell is a great performer and is accurately rated at 25A. I gave it an 1800mAh capacity rating, a bit higher than the claimed 1750mAh. It lists both the continuous and pulse ratings on the wrap and is the first cell to also list the pulse length and duty cycle for the pulse rating! This is fantastic and is a great step towards completely open and accurate cell ratings, thank you. The criteria for the pulse rating isn’t known (temperature? cycle life? voltage sag?) but the voltage at 50A pulsed is good and is comparable to, or better than, other cells rated around 25A.
It’s supposed to be a “hybrid” chemistry cell (sometimes called INR), but its discharge curves are much more like an ICR cell than other hybrid cells like the 25R and VTC4/5. Like an ICR its voltage holds pretty steady before quickly dropping as the cell approaches empty. I haven’t directly compared Busbars against the Tesiyi 40A 2600mAh or Aspire 40A 1800mAh ICR cells but hope to do so soon.
Test results, discharge graph, photos: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/threads/busbars-25a-1750mah-18650-bench-test-results-accurately-rated-25a-fantastic-battery.749931//
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: One Hundred 18650’s tested!
The ratings table has been updated several times the past couple of weeks so if you haven’t downloaded it recently, here it is. Three new Efests, two ESYBs, the Busbars, a Tesiyi, and the VTC5A battery have been added. This brings the total number of 18650’s tested up to 100 and there are still many, many more out there to get to.
Thank you for your support and for helping to spread the word on exaggerated battery ratings!
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