I would like to personally welcome Battery Mooch to TasteYourJuice.com.
“Mooch” is well known in the industry as the “battery guy” and is quite popular on the ECF. I’ve worked with Mooch several times in the background and he’s always been quite helpful and knowledgeable in answering my questions.
Although I have some experience with battery testing, Mooch has all the experience I lack so I though it a good fit to offer him his own page here on TasteYourJuice.com.
If you look to the left, you’ll see the new Battery Mooch page under Information/Resources. His first article can be found there as well.
WELCOME MY FRIEND!
Who is Battery Mooch?
My name is John Muchow, some of you may know me as Mooch on ECF and FB and Mooch315
on ECR. I have been vaping since April, 2015 and haven’t smoked once since I
started!I was born and raised in New York City and still live there now. Since 1992 I have
been designing and building electronic devices for a large number of clients. My
first products were camera remote-control systems for sports photographers. As these
systems, and other devices, transitioned from wired to wireless the performance of
the batteries they used was very important as there was no way to replace them
during use. This led to me doing more and more battery testing and developing the
electronics to charge, test, and protect them.As battery technology advanced, from NiCd to NiMH to Li-Ion and now
ultracapacitor/Li-Ion hybrids, the devices I built and the battery testing I did
advanced along with them. I started specializing in power management electronics;
battery chargers, energy harvesters (for charging from heat, light, or
vibration/movement), power supplies, battery analyzers, electronic loads for battery
discharging, and battery management/protection systems. This is the work I still do
today.My clients have included the US Army, National Geographic, Sports Illustrated,
Eastman Kodak Company, and hundreds of other companies from large to small. Part of
the work I’ve done for a lot of my clients has been battery testing. Sometimes they
want to recommend a good battery to their customers. Other times they’re batteries I
have chosen to combine with my electronics to form a complete, protected power
source for them to incorporate into their products.Depending on my client’s requirements this testing can take up to several weeks to
complete. I use a subset of these tests when evaluating the batteries we use when
vaping. This includes continuous-current tests to establish the battery’s true (and
safe) ratings. They also help to determine if there’s any risk of venting if one of
our mods autofires or a mechanical mod’s button is accidentally pressed. The
pulse-current tests measure the degree of voltage sag we would see when vaping at
different current levels. Both types of tests are done the same way for every set of
batteries I test.This consistency in the testing allows for direct comparison of the performance of
different batteries even if the pulse discharging I do doesn’t match the way you
vape.Safety is my number one priority. While I often test at discharge current levels
that can result in unsafe battery temperatures, this is the only way to figure out
what a battery’s true and safe ratings are. No battery is totally safe but we can
certainly avoid taking unnecessary risks.My blog at ECF has the results of all my testing and a few articles on batteries,
battery safety, etc.:https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/mooch.256958/
I have also listed the equipment I use and the steps I follow when testing. This
allows anyone to replicate my tests if they want to:https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/my-cell-testing-equipment-and-setup.7431/
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/whats-done-for-each-cell-test.7433/
My battery test results offer you a resource you can use when choosing a battery
that will not only be safer for the way you vape but will also give you great
performance.I’m looking forward to contributing to TasteYourJuice.com and I want to thank
PBusardo for the opportunity to help spread the word on exaggerated battery ratings
and battery safety!Mooch
Latest Battery Updates
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: AWT 10.5A 850mAh Flat Top 18350…a below average 6A 700mAh battery
This cell has overrated current and capacity ratings. It performs below average, a bit worse than the Nitecore 7A 700mAh cell I tested earlier.
The performance of any 18350 really suffers at higher current levels due to their very high internal resistance, leading to huge voltage sag. I recommend staying under their continuous current rating. This results in much more efficient operation and much longer vaping time.
The two cells I tested delivered 732mAh and 743mAh at 0.2A down to 2.5V.
I am estimating this AWT’s ratings at 6A and 700mAh. Current ratings for high internal resistance cells like these are a combination of the temperature the cell runs at and how badly the voltage sags, i.e., its Wh specs.
This is the third in a group of seven 18350’s I am testing and I will be posting a shootout between all of them after the individual test reports are posted. The top three performers will then be identified.
Two cells were purchased for the purposes of testing by me.
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/O6c3ay8
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Aspire Unrated 1100mAh Flat Top 18350…a good 9A battery
While not perfoming quite as well as the Vapcell 1100mAh in my testing this is a pretty good 18350. It delivers a bit less total energy, its Wh (watt-hour) spec, and runs a touch hotter than the Vapcell so I have given it a slightly lower current rating than the Vapcell.
Aspire does not list the ratings on the cell’s wrap but does include a paper insert that seems to indicate that they rate it at 10A. The insert also mentions a 15A “Vaping Simulation” rating using 10 second pulses spaced 5 seconds apart.
I really wish Aspire put the current rating on the cell as it is easy to lose the paper insert, leaving us with a cell with no rating. This can be a safety issue as well as a performance one.
The performance of any 18350 really suffers at high current levels like 15A due to their very high internal resistance, leading to huge voltage sag. I recommend staying under their continuous current rating. This results in much more efficient operation and much longer vaping time.
The two cells I tested delivered 1154mAh and 1166mAh at 0.2A down to 3.2V.
I am estimating this Aspire’s ratings at 9A and 1100mAh. Current ratings for high internal resistance cells like these are a combination of the temperature the cell runs at and how badly the voltage sags, i.e., its Wh specs.
This is the second in a group of seven 18350’s I am testing and I will be posting a shootout between all of them after the individual test reports are posted. The top three performers will then be identified.
Two cells were purchased for the purposes of testing by me.
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/mNy36QS
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: MXJO Yellow 10.5A 700mAh 18350…a below average 5A battery
While both of the cells I tested delivered a bit over their rated 700mAh of capacity they were poor performers with an exaggerated current rating. Their large voltage sag made them essentially unusable at 10A, as displayed by the huge drop in the Wh delivered between 5A and 10A.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings at 5A and 700mAh. Current ratings for high internal resistance batteries like these are a combination of the temperature the battery runs at and how badly the voltage sags, i.e., its Wh specs.
This is the first in a group of seven 18350’s I am testing and I will be posting a shootout between all of them after the individual test reports are posted. The top three performers will be identified.
Two cells were purchased for the purposes of testing by me.
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/1AJiweV
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Listman 40A 3800mAh 21700…only 30A but good performing battery
While this cell has an exaggerated current rating is it a good performer. It is identical in appearance and similar in performance to the Golisi S35 and Efest 35A 3700mAh 21700’s.
Both of these Listman cells had a bit over 4000mAh capacity. While this is a good thing it indicates that this cell might not be the exact same cell as used by Golisi and Efest.
Upon learning that this cell had an exaggerated rating, iJoy (the ones who donated the cells for testing) told me that they will instruct the factory to change the rating on the wrap from 40A to 30A. While I would definitely prefer that a cell was tested and rated accurately before being sold I am glad that iJoy is willing to change the exaggerated current rating.
There are earlier versions of this cell with a useless 60A “pulse” rating on the wrap. This was a ridiculous rating and I am glad it was removed.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings at 30A and 3800mAh minimum, though you might get more capacity from them than that.
Two cells were donated for the purposes of testing by iJoy (https://www.ijoycig.com). Thank you!
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/NMgMqzI
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: MXJO 20A 4000mAh 21700…accurately rated, good 30W-35W battery
This is an accurately rated high capacity cell that performs well up to about 10A-15A/30W-45W or so. Above that and the Golisi S35 3750mAh or Efest 3700Ah 21700’s are better performers due to their lower internal resistance.
It seems to be the same cell as used by the overrated Basen 30A 4000mAh 21700.
While it has the continuous rating marked on the wrap it also has a useless “max pulse” rating. This is a shame as it is accurately rated otherwise.
The two cells I tested delivered 4125mAh and 4243mAh at 0.5A down to 2.5 V, over their 4000mAh rating. While this is typical for Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, and Sanyo cells I don’t often see it for others.
It’s great though and I encourage other cell wrapping companies to stop using the highest capacity they find for a group of cells for their rating. The rating should be lower than the lowest capacity delivered by any cell, i.e., it should be a minimum capacity rating. It appears that this is what MXJO did.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings to be 20A and 4000mAh.
Two cells were purchased for the purposes of testing by me.
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/gIIqLbH
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: EnerCig EC-IFR20C 46A 2300mAh LiFePO4 26650…incredible performer, close to A123
These EnerCig samples were sent to me as a possible alternative for the incredible A123 ANR26650M1-B cells and they come close. These cells can easily be used at 40A.
These are LFP chemistry Li-Ion cells though (LiFePO4, lithium-ferrous-phosphate) and there are things you need to take into account before using them.
DO NOT USE THESE CELLS UNLESS YOU ARE COMLETELY FAMILIAR WITH OHM’S LAW, SERIES MECH MOD OPERATION, AND THE DIFFERENT CHARGING REQUIREMENTS FOR THESE CELLS.
While they are the safest chemistry we have easy access to they run at a lower voltage, 3.2V nominal, versus the 3.6V/3.7V nominal for the typical cells used for vaping.
This means that at high current levels these EnerCig’s run at under 3.0V and can’t be used in regulated mods as the mod will quickly signal low/weak battery. They can be used in series in a mechanical mod though.
Critically important is that all LFP chemistry cells must be charged to about 3.6V.
DO NOT USE THE STANDARD 4.2V CHARGING VOLTAGE!
This EnerCig has a 3.65V charging voltage specification and you can easily charge at 2A.
While not delivering the same amount of energy as the A123 26650 (A123 = 6.9Wh vs EnerCig = 6.0Wh at 40A down to 2.5V) this EnerCig does hit harder for a lot of a 40A discharge than the A123.
A123 cell’s are becoming very hard to buy now. These EnerCig’s are a good replacement in my opinion for series setups that can make the best of the high current rating but lower voltage of LFP chemistry cells. You will need to use a 3.6V/3.65V charger.
These EnerCig’s are great performing cells with incredibly flat discharge curves. That is, their voltage is very steady during use (after the initial voltage sag) all the way until the end. They perform more like LiPo’s than our standard round cells and this is good for use in a mech. The extra safety provided by the LFP chemistry is a great bonus along with their very low DC internal resistance.
The two cells I tested delivered 2323mAh and 2379mAh at 0.5A down to 2.5V.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings to be the same as those listed in their datasheet, 46A and 2300mAh. As with any cell though, operating at below its rating is more efficient and extends cell life. Operating two in series can easily do this though as the higher voltage increases the power to the coils without having to run at high current levels.
Two cells were donated for the purposes of testing by EnerCig (http://www.enercig.com). Thank you!
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/GS8FWQM
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Samsung 20Q 2000mAh 18650…a 15A battery, do not confuse with Samsung 20R or 20S
These were purchased to add to my “reference cell” library to help with counterfeit detection. This is a low performance, low capacity cell. It’s just not worth considering using for vaping.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings to be the same as Samsung’s ratings, 15A and 2000mAh.
Two cells were purchased for the purposes of testing by me.
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/ISu0uhq
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Vapcell 25A 2800mAh 18650…accurately rated, a Sony VTC5D rewrap
In my opinion this is a rewrap of the great performing Sony VTC5D, appearing and performing identically to the Sony. It performs slightly better than the VTC5A but not quite as well as the VTC6A.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings to be 25A and 2800mAh.
Two cells were donated for the purposes of testing by Vapcell (https://www.vapcelltech.com).
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/3JGY8t6
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Cylaid Yellow 60A 3100mAh 18650…Sony VTC6 rewrap with preposterous pulse rating
In my opinion this is a rewrap of the Sony VTC6, appearing and performing identically to the Sony. Because of the hugely exaggerated ratings I am giving this cell a Do Not Buy recommendation.
This Cylaid’s 40A continuous rating is hugely exaggerated as Sony rates the VTC6 at 15A continuous. Operating at higher current levels is mentioned in the datasheet but you must not exceed its 80°C maximum temperature rating. Rating this cell at 40A is outrageous.
This Cylaid’s 60A “pulse” rating is useless as we don’t know the width of the pulses, the time between them, and the criteria used to set the rating.
The Sony VTC6 is rated at 3000mAh so this Cylaid’s 3100mAh capacity is exaggerated too.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings to be the same as Sony’s ratings for the VTC6; 15A continuous, higher if not allowed to reach 75°C, and 3000mAh.
Two cells were purchased for the purposes of testing by me.
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/JdEZvMu
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
A BATTEEY MOOCH POST: Cylaid Purple 40A 3000mAh 18650…Samsung 30Q rewrap with useless pulse rating
In my opinion this is a rewrap of the Samsung 30Q, appearing and performing identically to the Samsung.
This Cylaid’s 25A continuous rating is exaggerated as Samsung rates the 30Q at 15A continuous. Operating at 20A is mentioned in the datasheet but you must not exceed its 75°C maximum temperature rating.
This Cylaid’s 40A “pulse” rating is useless as we don’t know the width of the pulses, the time between them, and the criteria used to set the rating.
I am estimating this cell’s ratings to be the same as Samsung’s ratings for the 30Q; 15A continuous, 20A if not allowed to reach 75°C, and 3000mAh.
Two cells were purchased for the purposes of testing by me.
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/O2O4kmi
I want to work for the vaping community full time! If you feel what I do is worth a couple dollars a month and you would like early access to battery availability and testing news and a say in what I test then please consider becoming a patron and supporting my testing efforts: https://www.patreon.com/batterymooch
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in my ratings tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market, we get swamped with fakes, or new information becomes available to me. Please, never assume that the ratings in the tables are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
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