A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Results of my Smok X8 and V8 teardown
Due to a couple of incidents of the popular Smok Stick V8 and X8 mods catching fire while charging I decided to check if there was anything I could see in a teardown that might indicate a possible cause.
Smok Stick X8 page: https://www.smoktech.com/kit/stick-x8
Smok Stick V8 page: https://www.smoktech.com/kit/stick-v8
Teardown photos: https://imgur.com/a/i1doD
A total of eleven units were cycled five times each and then disassembled and checked. The X8’s and V8’s I had were identical internally.
Bottom line…my testing and the disassembly/inspection was inconclusive. I didn’t see any obvious issues in any of the units I checked and all of them worked properly.
This does NOT mean that every Smok X8 and V8 is unconditionally “safe”!
This also does NOT mean “user error” caused the fires!
We can’t come to any conclusions from my teardown other than I had no issues with the ones I looked at.
I also received one of the units that caught fire during charging, along with the charger that was used. The device was completely charred internally. There was nothing left to inspect other than ashes. The Samsung 5V/1A USB charger block that was being used was still functioning normally, outputting a bit over 5.0V. No conclusions could be made regarding the cause of this device’s failure.
I’d like to thank Eva Campbell for donating three new X8’s, Lynda Abshear for donating two new V8’s and one of the burned V8’s, and All Day Vapes for donating three new X8’s and three new V8’s. Thank you!
Here is what I did for each unit:
– Cycled it three times using a Apple iPad USB charger (5.2V/2.4A) and then 0.13 ohm and 0.4 ohm coils for discharging until the unit would no longer fire. All of the units charged without incident and without getting more than warm externally (near the circuit board).
– The USB cable that shipped with one of the units was used for each charge and handled quite roughly every time it was inserted. I made sure to insert it “upside-down” first every time to try to replicate some of wear & tear it might see during use.
– Cycled it twice using the same coils as before but with a power supply to set the charging voltage to 4.5V to simulate a low quality, i.e., low voltage, USB charging block. All of the units charged without incident and without getting more than warm (near the circuit board).
– Disassembled and inspected it for missing padding or insulators, battery damage during assembly, inconsistent or low quality circuit board soldering, sloppy wiring runs, signs of overheating, missing mounting hardware, inconsistent soldering, etc.
My observations:
– Unit to unit assembly consistency was good except that two of the units had the circuit board soldered to the screw posts instead of using screws.
– Green vegetable grocery bag tape was used to hold the black negative wire from the battery to the circuit board. I guess it was an inexpensive option?
– The black negative wire going up the side of the battery was a very small gauge wire and got hot when about 23A was flowing through it with a freshly charged battery and a 0.13 ohm coil. No damage to the wire’s insulation or side of the battery was seen in any unit though.
– Charging current was 0.65A-0.70A for all the units.
– There was foam padding on the bottom and soft rubber padding on the top of the battery. These would help protect the battery from damage if the mod was dropped but I do not know how these would hold up after lots of drops over time.
– The end/side “flaps” of the pouch cell were very tightly folded against the cell so it all fit in the tube but no damage was seen in any of the cells when I removed the padding and the insulators and unfolded the flaps.
Conclusion:
Since we don’t know what the cause of the failures were I strongly recommend that charging ANY mod should always be done on a non-flammable surface with someone nearby the entire time in case something goes wrong.
Since these kits are sold to newer vapers I’d like to see a decent USB charging block included. It would add minimal cost and prevent the use of low quality chargers.
One of the two 1A USB charging blocks I received with the burnt out unit, but was not being used when the unit caught fire, outputted only 3.90V and less than 0.5A when used. That is about 3.7V to the battery once it passes through the USB cable and the circuit board. This results in a battery that is not fully charged and it could possibly cause problems with the unit’s electronics as this is much lower than the 4.40V minimum voltage for USB these units might be expecting.
I don’t know if low charging voltages, and low quality USB chargers, are a problem or not but including a charger with the unit would make them more “all-in-one” kits and help limit the use of crappy chargers.
IMPORTANT – PLEASE ACT & SHARE!! – Modernize the Predicate Date for Vapor Products!
This will not take you long to do. Please be involved, take action, and SHARE!!
Budget negotiations are happening right now and we only have a short time to make an impression. This is the time to reach out to Congress and urge them to support us.
By March 22nd, Congress will need to come up with a plan to fund a massive two-year spending package. Right now, we have an opportunity to urge support for predicate date change language in the appropriations side of the 2018 budget that will keep vapor products on the market beyond FDA’s prohibition date of 2022.
At the same time, those of you who live in districts represented by a co-sponsor of the stand-alone version of the predicate date change (HR 1136) will be sending a thank you message. As much as some in Congress need encouragement to support us, those who are already on our side need to hear that we support them.
Help us show Congress that we are unified in our support for changing the predicate date to August 8th, 2016 and that we are in favor of reasonable regulation that protects young people and preserves consumer choice.
PLEASE take action HERE.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: Battery Basics for Vapers Ep1 is now available on my Battery Mooch YouTube channel
This is the first in a series of videos for newer vapers and those transitioning from regulated to unregulated and vice versa. Or, just anyone who wants to learn more about batteries.
Episode 1 covers thirty-four battery related words and phrases.
WIN A KROMA-A KIT FROM INNOKIN!
Win the Kroma A + Zenith Kit from Innokin
March MTL Madness! 21 Winners, 45 prizes.
Enter quick to be in the running. First winners announced!
Innokin – MTL pioneers.
The Kroma-A is a compact and ergonomic mod with a full set of features, designed and manufactured by the geniuses at Innokin.
For the kit, the mod is topped with the Zenith Atomiser, aimed squarely at the Mouth-To-Lung style vaper. It works sublimely with nicotine salts liquids!
It’s simple to enter, just visit the giveaway page and choose how you want to enter at the bottom (email or enter with social accounts).
To find out all about the Kroma, watch review videos, see the full specs, visit the Kroma Kit ECF Brand-Connect page.
Prizes!
All winners will receive Kroma-A + Zenith Kit. First and second prize winners will also receive an Ares MTL RTA: the MTL specialist tank designed in collaboration with Phil Busardo and Dimitri “Vaping Greek” Agrafiotis.
We’ve already picked 6 winners, and there’s plenty more to go around (but get in there quick!)
The prizes are:
3 x First Place winners to win 2 x Kroma-A + Zenith MTL Platform Series Kits & 1 Ares MTL RTA.
7 x Second Place winners to win 1 x Kroma-A + MTL Zenith Platform Series Kits & 1 Ares MTL RTA.
10 x Third Place winners to win 1 x Kroma-A + MTL Zenith Platform Series Kits.
Grand prize
And one lucky ECF member will pick up the special Grand Prize! A metal Innokin carry-case packed with complete sets of Innokin MTL Vaporizers and Tanks, along side some extra surprises.
Wave 1 winners (March 12th Draw).
Congratulations to:
1st Prize: ( 2 * Kroma-A+Zenith kit & 1*Ares): Steve P (USA)
2nd Prize: (1*Kroma-A+Zenith kit & 1*Ares): Jose M.S.F (Portugal) & Kane P.O (Australia)
3rd Prize: (1*Kroma-A+Zenith kit): Dale J (USA), Dmitry S. (Russia) & Caroline D (USA)
Innokin will contact you directly ASAP so you can claim the prizes.
About ECF Giveaways
Each month ECF offers all vapers the chance to win the latest mods from the top brands. For over two years we’ve been hosting these, hundreds of vapers have gotten their hands on top gear. Free.
There’s no obligation and it takes seconds to participate. We don’t share your details with anyone (unless you win, when we have to for fulfilment!), and we never, ever, spam.
Sound too good to be true? It isn’t! Give it a go, you might well be lucky – many others have been.
As always, T&Cs apply.
Good luck,
Oliver
ANOTHER HAPPY WIENER!!
Congrats to Eric on winning the Yihi SX Mini MX-Class and Zenith Tank!!
Hey Phil,
The prize pack came today! I’m excited all over again! It’s like Vapemas! That SX Mini is awesome and I’m enjoying the Zenith tank as well. It looks pretty sexy on the Kroma-A too. Thank you again for drawing my name. From one vaper to another sincerely, thank you for all you do. I could not have made the transition without you and your videos. You make them fun, entertaining, and very informative. All things I needed when I made the switch. Tell Dimitris I said hello and thank you for what he does in advocacy. We HAVE to save the industry. If you ever come back to the Charlotte area we’ll have a vape and shoot the bull. That’s enough of me rambling lol. Thank you friend!
Eric Johnson
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: EHPRO/Bootes Bronze-Black 3500mAh 30A 18650…just a 10A 3300mAh battery, DO NOT BUY
EHPRO/Bootes (not the EHPRO e-cig company) markets this cell to vapers but their web site clearly states it’s not meant for use with e-cigarettes and that it is a serious misuse of the cell. We’ve seen retail vendors do this, it’s just a standard liability statement, but when the battery wrapping company does this with their own cells then is it done at our expense?
What should we do when a company is willing to sell us something, pocket the profits, and then say not to use what we bought? If you didn’t buy direct from their web site you’d never know they say not to use with e-cigs. Just something to consider. This is different than what Sony and LG do as they do not market to vapers and they actively try to keep us from using their cells.
Since EHPRO/Bootes does not want anyone to use this cell with any vaping device I am giving it a Do Not Buy recommendation.
There is no rating on this cell other than “30A MAX”. But if you go to the EHPRO/Bootes web site it says it has a 20A continuous rating. This cell doesn’t even have the tiny “max continuous discharge” and “max pulse discharge” ratings on the wrap that some of the other EHPRO/Bootes cells have.
No customer should have to go on a quest to hunt down the continuous rating of a cell they are using. Any “max”, “pulse”, or “max pulse” rating is useless as we don’t know the pulse length, time between pulses, and the criteria they used to set the rating (temperature? voltage sag? cycle life? A combination of those or other things?). We’re not able to compare this cell’s pulse rating to any other’s.
Unfortunately, the 30A “max” rating is preposterous and the capacity is exaggerated too. At 30A the voltage instantly dropped to about 3.10V. This cell appears and performs identically to the 10A 3300mAh Sanyo NCR18650GA.
I am rating this EHPRO/Bootes cell at 10A and 3300mAh for any non-vaping use.
Two cells were donated for the purposes of testing by EHPRO/Bootes (http://www.ehpropower.com). Thank you!
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/NAeBG
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in the tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market or we get swamped with fakes. Please, never assume that the ratings in the table are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
THE VAPTIO WALL (NOT WEB) CRAWLER + LAST “NOT A” CONTEST WINNER AND A NEW ONE!
A PBusardo Review – The Vaptio Wall Crawler + Last Contest Winner & A New One!
In this video the Vaptio Wall Crawler get’s the “Full Busardo” treatment. We also find out who won the last “Not A” Contest and kick off a new one!
Oh… and we rave a little bit too. 🙂
The Links:
Vaptio
Wall Crawler @ Heaven Gifts
VapeBromance
Joyetech
Innokin
The Video:
*NOTE: Any use of these videos in part or in their entirety without Phil Busardo’s expressed written consent is strictly prohibited.
The Photos:
The Test Report:
Vaptio Wall Crawler - ReviewForm
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: There are two EHPRO companies!
One of them wraps the batteries I have been testing, “Shenzhen EHPRO Battery Technology Company, Ltd” or “Shenzhen EHPRO Technology Company, Ltd” or “Bootes Battery Technology Company Ltd.” depending on where you look (www.ehpropower.com)
The other, “Shenzhen Ehpro Technology Company, Ltd.”, makes mods and atomizers like the Billow, Big Buddha, and Bachelor (www.szehpro.com).
Web site comparison: https://imgur.com/a/XBLnz
Both of them say that they are not the same company. The mod/atty Ehpro company appears to have registered the “Ehpro” trademark for those types of devices and the battery Ehpro company appears to have registered “Ehpro” for batteries some time later.
The mod/atty Ehpro company claims they have been trying for a while to stop the battery Ehpro company from using “Ehpro”. The battery Ehpro company says they registered the trademark legally.
I’m not getting any further into this as it seems to boil down to China’s trademark laws, timing, and who knows what else. I’m only relaying what they’ve told me. I do not know what else might be going on behind the scenes here….if anything. Do not assume that there is anything.
The batteries I am testing are from the battery Ehpro/Bootes company at www.ehpropower.com. I will emphasize that more when I post the last two test reports.
A BATTERY MOOCH POST: EHPRO/Bootes Yellow-Black 3000mAh 60A 18650…only 20A-25A battery, EHPRO/Bootes says do not use with e-cigs!
EHPRO/Bootes (not the EHPRO e-cig company) markets this cell to vapers but their web site clearly states it’s not meant for use with e-cigarettes and that it is a serious misuse of the cell. We’ve seen retail vendors do this, it’s just a standard liability statement, but when the battery wrapping company does this with their own cells then is it done at our expense?
What should we do when a company is willing to sell us something, pocket the profits, and then say not to use what we bought? If you didn’t buy direct from their web site you’d never know they say not to use with e-cigs. Just something to consider. This is different than what Sony and LG do as they do not market to vapers and they actively try to keep us from using their cells.
Since EHPRO/Bootes does not want anyone to use this cell with any vaping device I am giving it a Do Not Buy recommendation.
On the wrap, in the tiniest lettering I’ve ever seen on a cell, it says it’s rated 35A continuous and 60A “max pulse discharge”.
Unfortunately, the 35A continuous rating is greatly exaggerated. This EHPRO/Bootes cell appears and performs identically to the 20A-25A Sony VTC6A.
I haven’t seen the datasheet for the VTC6A to know Sony’s ratings but EHPRO/Bootes’ claim of 35A is ridiculous. At that high a discharge current level this cell becomes hot enough to boil water. The VTC6A might have a temperature-limited rating that high but you must stop the discharge before the cell reaches 80°C. This means it cannot be a continuous current rating.
The 60A EHPRO/Bootes’ “pulse” rating is useless.
Any “max”, “pulse”, or “max pulse” rating is useless as we don’t know the pulse length, time between pulses, and the criteria they used to set the rating (temperature? voltage sag? cycle life? A combination of those or other things?). We’re not able to compare this cell’s pulse rating to any other’s.
I am rating this EHPRO/Bootes cell at 20A-25A and 3000mAh for any non-vaping use.
Two cells were donated for the purposes of testing by EHPRO/Bootes (http://www.ehpropower.com). Thank you!
Ratings graphic: https://imgur.com/a/nOt0z
These tests only note the estimated ratings for these batteries at the time I tested them. Any battery that is not a genuine Samsung, Sony, LG, Panasonic, or Sanyo can change at any time! This is one of the hazards of using “rewrapped” batteries or batteries from other manufacturers so carefully research any battery you are considering using before purchasing.
Misusing or mishandling lithium-ion batteries can pose a SERIOUS RISK of personal injury or property damage. They are not meant to be used outside of a protected battery pack. Never exceed the battery’s continuous current rating and keep the plastic wrap and top insulating ring in perfect condition.
Any rating in the tables can change at any time as different grade cells appear on the market or we get swamped with fakes. Please, never assume that the ratings in the table are permanent and will never change! Always download the latest version before considering any cell purchase.
To see how other cells have tested check out this link: https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blog-entry/list-of-battery-tests.7436/
FROM DOCTOR FARSALINOS – E-cigarette flavors and aldehyde emissions: another failure to verify findings from a previous study
More than 1 year ago, a study was published in the journal Environmental Science and Technology reporting that aldehyde emissions from e-cigarettes are derived from thermal degradation of flavoring compounds rather than the main liquid ingredients (propylene glycol and glycerol). The study found non-detectable levels of aldehydes in unflavored liquids, but up to 10,000-fold higher levels of aldehydes in flavored samples.
You can read the entire article HERE.
Store
